What About Women? - Destiner Press Topics

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Origins and Destinies"And I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man, but to be in silence." (1 Timothy 2:12)

"Let women keep silent in the assemblies, for they are not permitted to speak; but they are to be submissive, as the law also says." (1 Corinthians 14:34)

What About Women?

I have been asked repeatedly to deal with this subject, specifically by ladies who feel crushed, offended or disheartened by such Scriptures as those quoted above. I will cover the core issue as concisely as possible but it will be necessary to illustrate a broad picture in order to put this matter in perspective. To begin then, and straight to the point, let us be clear that this topic is about women in the elect, not women in the church. If you are not yet clear that these two entities are not the same thing then you will need to read The Truth Which Sets Free and, when it becomes available, The Dark Powers That Bind.

The elect must be careful to avoid being overly distracted by the pointless controversies that occupy the goats of the church. Churchmen may ordain women priests or chaplains, excommunicate each other from their denominations and "isms", marry homosexuals, unionize their "clergy" to prevent abuse by the "laity" and whatever other antics in which they continually immerse themselves. That is for the orcs of another realm mired in bickering, the neo-pagans arguing amongst each other,  the blind wrestling the blind into the pit. Theirs is not a valid debate for the elect. Theirs is a kingdom of this world that has no intention of submitting to the Word of God. The kingdom of the elect is not of this world and must inherently and willingly bow to the Word of God.

It is a favorite ploy of goats to attempt to evade the Word in this particular subject by saying it is just a cultural item and no longer applies. With this same pretext they can (and do) excuse themselves from countless truths which they do not like simply by labeling them as belonging to an age that has passed and  no longer valid. For instance, one variation on this specific theme is that the apostle Paul supposedly referred to an organizational problem: namely that women sat separately at the periphery in "early churches" (following previous Jewish traditions in synagogue arrangements) and had to shout out to their husbands for the meaning of a doctrinal interpretation, resulting in such disorder that they were instructed to keep silent, a situation that no longer applies today.

The fact is that the elect met in all kinds of venues, especially houses, some with standing room only so that one might even fall out a window. There was no such separation of men from women, nor was there any building of churches. It was the early Christians who strove to re-create the house made with hands. That is what remains, for instance, in the ruins of ancient Corinth. I have examined that "church" structure and nothing about it persuades me it was an elect venture or undertaking but merely another example of early copy-cats blending the Word with pagan traditions and temple devotion that Christ had rendered obsolete. Paul in particular was a stickler in avoiding the Jewish customs which his Master had swept away, even facing off with the apostle Peter when he erred in this area, declaring that to build again what was rightfully destroyed was outright sin. (Galatians 2:11-18) Paul did not write to a church, ever, for we now know that this is an unscriptural term except to describe the pagan temple, and should be struck from every occurrence in erroneous Bible translations where it has been inserted to refer to God's chosen.

The apostle's teaching regarding women is not some temporary ethnic or cultural doctrine, like the various health-related rules where God forbade the eating of certain animals and then later permitted it. There is no later change of instruction with regards to the role or position of women in Scripture; nor can there be. The answer to the question is really very simple. But, before I state the obvious and evident conclusion, I invite you to examine many facets of this particular gem, the same truth viewed from many angles, because it is a precious stone if seen in its correct context. This rock hard yet luminous diamond helps separate the wheat from the tares, especially in today's environment where the children of disobedience are scrambling over each other to deny and distort the truth.

  • It is not credible that women should be silent in absolute terms: not greet, not sing a psalm, not pray, not ever open their mouths among their fellows in Christ. It cannot be, not with the masses of Scriptural encouragement to all the saints, male and female, to sing praises and pray and give thanks. Women not included? That kind of dogma led to the formation of many early sects that put women in cloisters and eventually helped spawn the worst and most repressive of all the Judeo-Christian offshoots which we now know as Islam. Such subjugation of women is not the Way, Truth or Life. To relegate women to that level of muteness, confining them behind doors and veils, is a very great evil.

  • Jesus said he would be there where even two or three elect are gathered. Is he not there when two or three women meet? Of course. Are they to sit in silence? Of course not. If there is a man present are they then constrained to be speechless? Inconceivable.

  • To whom did Christ first reveal himself as the real and lasting water, and blow away the delusions she had of the worldly "house of God" (so cherished by church goats in all generations)? A Samaritan woman, much to the amazement and objections of his Jewish apostles. (See Chapter 2, The Truth Which Sets Free.)

  • Whom did Jesus commend for choosing the "good part," the real and lasting bread, the Word over the kitchen? A woman. (Luke 10:42) Would that all men could be so attentive and forget thinking about their bellies!

  • Who were in the majority to attend the crucifixion and the guarded tomb? Women.

  • When Jesus wistfully says that God's laborers are few, is he meaning just men, because women do not count to speak and enlighten others in the revelation of his Word? Not credible.

  • Does the company of saints, the royal priesthood, which is the truly ordained Body of Christ (made up of God's chosen and predestined children, whose names are in the book of life from eternity, and who therefore must all function in this office of revealing God to man and bringing man to God) not include women? It cannot possibly be so. (See Chapter 8, The Truth Which Sets Free.)

Having said all that I now look at this matter from another viewpoint. But before I do that let me caution you in considering an often misquoted Scripture: that in Christ there is "neither Jew nor Greek, neither slave nor free, neither male nor female" because all the elect are "one in Christ Jesus." (Galatians 3:28) This is quite true in the light of salvation, and that is clearly the context in this verse in Galatians, the equality of saved souls. We could rightly add, "neither black nor white, neither king nor subject, neither psychiatrist nor mental patient, neither adult nor child." That does not give them all the same status in other contexts, especially in the area of authority. This is the same apostle Paul, here writing to the Galatians, who also wrote that a woman was not permitted to teach or have authority over a man, or to speak in the elect assembly. So then, how can this be? To understand we must also look at the rest of the Biblical picture, where we are faced with these hard and fast facts.

  • God is always referred to in male terminology in His Word. The neo-pagan goats of the church are of course working on changing this, and have always done so, either leaning to the goddesses of outright paganism, inventing female co-saviours like Mary, or trying to "neuter" God by rewriting the Bible to suit the "politically correct." There will be no help for these creatures on the Last Day. Do not be found in agreement with such sacrilege, unless of course you actually hope to spend eternity in such company.

  • God sent his only begotten Son, not a daughter. This may seem obvious to you, but it is a most hated truth to extreme feminists or sodomites trying to pervert gender or make a she-male of the Lord. Jesus said that men and women "neither marry nor are given in marriage" in heaven (Matthew 22:30) but he did not say that there was neither male nor female in heaven. Quite the contrary. It is true that "it has not yet been revealed what we shall be," writes the apostle John, "but we shall be like him (Christ)." (1 John 3:2) Like Christ, the elect may have new and imperishable bodies but they also take with them the selves they once were in this world, albeit purified from every blemish. The resurrected Christ was still a man, and though he pre-existed as the eternal Son of God he returned to heaven taking that body with him. He sat down again as the Son (not daughter) at the right hand of the Father (not mother).

  • There is no Mother of God, except in Christian cursing. Mary, the surrogate, who was indeed extremely blessed beyond imagination as the vessel for the formation of Christ in the flesh, was just that, simply, and miraculously apart from the normal way of human life, the bearer of the child Jesus. She did not conceive God. She was, in a sense, the mother of the man, but not the Mother of God, Who is eternal and has no beginning or end. The blasphemous title, Mother of God, was an invention of the Early Church. (See: Chapter 6, Early Christian Councils, The Truth Which Sets Free.) Nor is Mary the physical expression of the Holy Spirit, as some Christians like to describe her. The Holy Spirit is always referred to as a distinct person, as the Lord, and in male terminology throughout Scripture, including all references to him in Christ's own words. (For a concise overview of his person and work see: Spirit Of The Living God)

  • God first made man in his image, and subsequently took from his side the woman and helpmate. (Genesis 2; I Corinthians 11: 8,9) The first human being made from the dust of the earth was a man, not a woman. (1 Corinthians 15:45-49) The apostle Paul uses this essential truth in a very specific area concerning women not being allowed to speak. (1 Timothy 2:11-13)

  • The forefathers are called just that, fathers (Abraham, Isaac, Jacob), not foremothers (Sarah, Rebecca, Leah, Rachel), even though God's children would not exist without these women of faith.

  • The heads of all the tribes of Israel were men.

  • The deliverer from Egypt and Messianic foreshadower was male.

  • The major and minor prophets (man-made terms, none are minor) through whom such awesome revelations poured were all men.

  • Israel was granted kings, not queens (although they should have desired neither).

  • Jesus chose 12 apostles, all men. Not 6 men and 6 women. Not even 11 men and one woman, and this despite his close and faithful female associates.

  • The main helpers chosen to assist the apostles at home base, in the early assembly at Jerusalem, were men. (e.g. Stephen)

  • The main aides chosen by the apostles for their travels were men (e.g. Timothy, Luke).

  • Although we do not know the name of the writer of every book in the Old Testament, the ones we do know are all men, and the few we do not know are assumed to be men (e.g. Samuel as the author of Ruth, Mordecai or Ezra as the author of Esther) because the assignment of the written Word was never given to women.

  • Every book in the New Testament has a male author.

This could be pursued in further detail but there is by far sufficient here to show that this principle is not simply an Old Testament or New Testament principle (again, man-made terms) but one truth, and the Bible is one book for those who are one in the Lord, his elect. Yes we have an Esther and a Ruth and a Mary and so many others who played such vital roles in times and tasks where a million men went unnamed in Scripture. But women have never been in authority in the way that men were so placed by God, and they can never assume this particular headship to substitute for men. Women may do this in the church but in terms of the kingdom of God they cannot succeed, no matter how extreme their effort, not even if they do it by dressing like a man or physically trying to "change" their gender, because they are already in the wrong body altogether.

So now I will state it categorically. When the Word says that women should "be silent" or "not speak" it means that they cannot presume to act as the principal authority, speaker, teacher or leader in one of the elect assemblies, the kind of gathering to whom the apostle Paul expressly addressed his letters. It may be helpful here to compare the subordinate position of a woman in the family (dealt with in detail in Ephesians 5:22-33, except that the word church should be replaced in every instance with a correct term; see Chapter 4, Right Word, Right Place, The Truth Which Sets Free) with the secondary position of a woman in an elect assembly. There is an obvious parallel truth. In both situations a woman may talk or sing or pray but in neither situation, physical family group or spiritual family gathering, may she be head, or speak as if she was in the position of head. It is a delicate balancing act. If a woman is confined to silence inappropriately the circumstances descend into the repression of Islam and other cults that Satan has concocted to replace the Truth and the Life. But if she speaks as head, taking that place of a man, then that too is a substitution for the Way, and substitution is the name of the game in Satan's grand plan.

This is not license for chauvinism on the part of men nor an invitation for willfulness on the part of their female helpmates. Men did not make themselves in headship, and many would rather not have this authority or responsibility. But they did not make the world, and neither did women. The creatures shall answer to the Creator, and woe to those who would claim to rewrite His statutes and ordinances. And this they do, having no fear of God, no beginning of wisdom whatsoever. If the goats would redefine "marriage" as the union of two men or two women (who is head in such sodomite relationships? and what is coming next as a family? three women? two men and a dog?) then they will certainly try to put forward women priests and pastors. But again, that is for the church, not for the children of God, not for the Lord's chosen.

This is hardly a big exclusion, that women may not be head or speak as such. It is no different from the Lord saying, "you may eat the fruit of all the trees in the garden except for this one." The Word does not exclude elect women speaking in a host of other contexts, but it does prevent them in this one area, and herein lies the temptation. Indeed, the goats of both genders so covet and strive to create such futile positions in their house made with hands that they will call each other "father" and "mother" and even "mother-superior" or "reverend" in direct contradiction of Scripture because they so love to disobey. It is precisely what they are told not to do that they crave all the more, and why they will fall and perish, as they are destined to do. Leave them where they belong, in church. It is bad enough that men take up positions as hireling shepherds, let alone women. Let churchmen and churchwomen do whatever they will as they stumble without fear toward the wide gate, and let the elect walk in the narrow and straight Way set out for them in the Word.

"Let this mind be in you," writes the apostle Paul, "which was also in Christ Jesus." What mind? The mind that does not demand the higher position but rather accepts one's appointed life of service, with humility and obedience, even to the death if necessary. (Philippians 2:5-8) If Christ himself so complied to his Father's will so too should the children of God strive to obey (which the Goats do not) with fear and trembling (which the goats lack) in the midst of a crooked and perverse generation (which the goats are) by holding to the word (which the goats twist) otherwise the race is in vain (which it is, for the goats). (Philippians 2:12-15) Jesus demonstrated precisely this mind of compliance to his disciples, and taught them to pray: "Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven." (Matthew 5:10)

God's will concerning women is clear and simple enough. Simple, that is, in statement, not necessarily in understanding or reception. The most studied churchman or "theologian" will remain blind and obstinate while the uneducated fisherman, given ears to hear, can both see and submit. If you find it difficult to accept then consider the supreme example of Christ who most certainly did consent to his Father's will in every aspect, no matter how hard the plan or the way. "Nevertheless, not my will, but Yours be done." (Luke 22:42) Many times the Lamb of God repeated this truth, that he came not to do his own will but that of his Father. (John 4:34, 5:30, 6:38) Goats do not have this objective in mind, nor is it written in their hearts. They seek to do their own will and say it is God's way. They live, and die, in a substitute.

If you have not yet done so then this may be the right time to read some critical Scriptures and consider the difference between the nature of true shepherd/priests and those of the church. (See: Chapter 8, Early Christian Councils, The Truth Which Sets Free.)



And what about the other trees, that is, positions of leadership elsewhere? No one can deny that in the world women have made great leading lights, from scientific researchers and doctors to judges and prime ministers. Elect women are not barred from such positions. But I do make this cautionary comment. I completely agree with the few writers of the past who have firmly held that no elect person (of either gender) should run for political office because of the inherent duplicity and spirit of compromise required. We may get our hands outwardly muddy in helping a grimy world but not engage in "professions" that by their very nature call for double-mindedness or soil the mind and spirit. Do not be conformed to the world or stained by it. (Romans 12:2, James 1:27) The same might be said of most (not all) of the legal profession, much of which is even dirtier than it was when Jesus berated the lawyers of his day. Do not waste your life in any pursuit or career that falls into this category. That is not the work or calling Jesus has for his laborers. There is a much more worthy fight at hand for a kingdom and reward that does not fade or perish. And in this kingdom the elect are not to copy the world, because it is not of the world.

There is so much for the true laborers to do, and, as in the time of Christ, there are so few of them, both men and women. How sparsely this remnant is scattered in the world! Pray for more laborers of both genders, and look on the bright side. Small is beautiful. Jesus walked with a dozen, not 144 or 1000. The most he ever sent out on a mission was 70, and those in pairs for a temporary assignment. His regular fellowship was just twelve men and a few special women, with only one bad apple (as ordained) in the barrel. When the crowds followed him there were many rotten apples: those who tagged along for the prospect of a free loaf of bread or the attraction of miracles, or who simply went with the herd, like churchmen in a dreamy stupor, or those who tagged along seeking to trip him in his words. From such followers the Lord often withdrew, or caused them to withdraw instead, with words too hot for them to handle.

When things get big it automatically brings organizational problems that can distract from the core matter at hand, and this can be very detrimental. There is no pride or gain in numbers; that is a church delusion. Better to separate into more personal and effective groups than to become unwieldy, and far better to divide than be divisive. Not that there is anything wrong with large fellowships. Who knows? There may yet again be an outpouring of the Spirit as in times past when so many sheep will gather that the question of who speaks and who listens will become a major problem. But don't hold your breath. And in the meantime pay no great attention to the goats except to learn what not to do. Their house is as organized as a church cemetery, and just as full. As though the Body of Christ was anything like their religious establishments! Let the weeds multiply in their own yard. They go the way of the world, as churchdom has always done. The elect must not.

May God shine his face upon you and give you wisdom and power, every one of you, man and woman, to be laborers in the true calling and speak for Him in the right place and at the right time.